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UnknownTherian
March 22nd, 2013, 09:12 AM
I know that right now everyone is being very suspicious of some TV channel wanting to make a documentary on therianthropy while inlcuding the 'lifestyle' of therians (casting call), and how, understandably, we don't want anyone to accept, in case we are portrayed in a bad light.

People on the site have already suggested making their own documentaries, but what about a book of stories/articles? I've read many things on the Werelist, and other therian sites, that I really enjoyed reading. Before I discovered I was a therian, I read things that helped me understand therianthropy, and led me to realise what I am. Now, I read things that I can relate to, which helps me feel that I am not alone (even though I know there are many therians). Then I read things that I may not understand, or relate to, but find interesting and enjoyable all the same.

What if everyone on the Werelist wrote something, or use something they had written before, and then a book was made of them? Since it would be full of 'stories' rather than 'long-boring-articles-that-make-you-fall-asleep', non-therians should find them more inviting, and since everything was written by the therians themselves, we wouldn't be portrayed badly.

I really want people's thoughts on this.

PS If this is in the wrong place, please tell me so I can move it somehow. :)

Crowsong
March 22nd, 2013, 09:18 AM
I think its a great idea, but, if its a book in the typical sense someone would be making money off of it, and who would that be? Also, who would publish such a piece?

hotdogwolf
March 22nd, 2013, 11:41 AM
I think that would be a great idea unknownTherian but the problem would be trying to find someone to publish it. Not many people have heard of us, So it mit be hard at first. so keep trying and good luck.

Natsilani
March 22nd, 2013, 11:46 AM
I agree with Lemur, there are logistics that would have to be worked out. I might suggest that the proceeds go to funding therian-community sites like Werelist, especially if it's Werelist members who are the authors of the stories. But anyway...

I think it's a great idea in theory. And it would be fun I think. But what kind of stories would we be looking for? And how many?

UnknownTherian
March 22nd, 2013, 09:17 PM
Well, I agree with Solomon.K. about using the proceeds for sites like this one. It would be difficult to find someone to publish it, though.

I'm not sure how to describe the type of stories, does anyone want me to put up some examples?
And to be fair, everyone would have one of their writings put into the book, but there are so many members on the Werelist... maybe if the best writers were chosen somehow? Maybe using a poll including active writers on the Werelist?

Savage
March 22nd, 2013, 11:29 PM
We could solicit writings for such a book, and publish it as an e-book under a 'free if you can't afford it, please donate on a sliding scale if you can afford it' model.

Where would we put the money? I dunno. Basic site maintenance costs and occasional software updates for this site, perhaps, with the caveat that if more was collected than we actually need for bare expenses, we would fund other worthy causes. Scholarships to bring needy folks to Howls, perhaps, or helping to fund bandwidth and hosting for other informational/community therian sites.

Because it would be free to anyone who did not have extra money to pay for it, I don't expect there would be a ton of profit. But that wouldn't be the point of the thing anyhow.

I do have the ability to edit and typeset, but I would prefer to be the person of last resort here. I can help, but don't particularly want to be the only one doing the work of collecting articles and proofing/editing/typesetting them. Any other volunteers on board with experience preparing manuscripts for publication?

ShadowWalker
March 23rd, 2013, 03:29 AM
This idea came up awhile back on another site, so I'll have to point the person in the direction of this thread. I think it's a really brilliant idea, I'd love to own a book like that. I think if you wanted it to be a physical book, there's always the possibility of self publishing and having the cost of the book equal to the price it costs to publish, although the e-book model is much simpler.

A collection of writings could also go in a similar way to The Forest Voice (http://otherkin.livejournal.com/562625.html), although that is more poetic based.

I wouldn't say pick the best writers, because I think there are a lot of therian writers out there who aren't widely known who can write some brilliant stuff, but perhaps have it open for submissions instead? And some kind of voting system on submissions, as well as several editors to work with the writers to correct grammatical/structural/spelling/whatever errors?

Velvet Wings
March 23rd, 2013, 05:22 AM
I think a collection of stories written by the community would make a very interesting read.


We could solicit writings for such a book, and publish it as an e-book under a 'free if you can't afford it, please donate on a sliding scale if you can afford it' model.

Where would we put the money? I dunno. Basic site maintenance costs and occasional software updates for this site, perhaps, with the caveat that if more was collected than we actually need for bare expenses, we would fund other worthy causes. Scholarships to bring needy folks to Howls, perhaps, or helping to fund bandwidth and hosting for other informational/community therian sites.

Because it would be free to anyone who did not have extra money to pay for it, I don't expect there would be a ton of profit. But that wouldn't be the point of the thing anyhow.

That sounds like a great idea Savage. I think having any money made go back into the community is definitely the best step way to go.
Making it free with optional donation is also a nice idea. That way it would not only be open to those with less income, but also to the school aged therians/non-therians who aren't comfortable asking their parents for money to buy it.

Rooks
March 23rd, 2013, 07:25 AM
I do have the ability to edit and typeset, but I would prefer to be the person of last resort here. I can help, but don't particularly want to be the only one doing the work of collecting articles and proofing/editing/typesetting them. Any other volunteers on board with experience preparing manuscripts for publication?


I would be willing for such a task. Although I am no keen writer, and do not posses great editing skills, the thought of contributing to the publication of a book gladdens me. I will help with proof reading and sorting, if I may.

I will add a vote of support for this project, and also say this: I know of some printers where I live. They are small, and a non-profit group, but perhaps I could seek their guidance in this matter. They publish books and pamphlets regarding radical progressive politics, and as such I am fairly confidant in there willingness to, at the very least, offer words of advice. Rebel Press (http://www.rebelpress.org.nz/about) is their name.

Online printing services also exist. Book binding could be simple, like ring-bound cookbooks.

Perhaps a poll on the writing subforum could be cast? To find willing authors? Still, I would prefer the project to remain more open to submitted works.

Lastly, I strongly agree on keeping the publication open and free (as in freedom). It should be released under a Creative Commons license, so that others may create divergent works and be free to print at will.

That is all. I am glad that this is going forth, none the less. It will be pleasant having something to show others that we are not by and large, ahh, a bunch of "deranged lunatics".

EDIT: I almost forgot to add, if you are concerned about the cost then why not crowd-fund the project? The funding could be used to provide copies of the book to those who can't afford it, or used to enlist the services of professional designers. Just a thought.

UnknownTherian
March 23rd, 2013, 10:05 AM
We could solicit writings for such a book, and publish it as an e-book under a 'free if you can't afford it, please donate on a sliding scale if you can afford it' model.

Where would we put the money? I dunno. Basic site maintenance costs and occasional software updates for this site, perhaps, with the caveat that if more was collected than we actually need for bare expenses, we would fund other worthy causes. Scholarships to bring needy folks to Howls, perhaps, or helping to fund bandwidth and hosting for other informational/community therian sites.

I agree, it should be free, and the ebook idea is brilliant. In fact, I wasn't even thinking of making money off it at all, but if money was made it would be good to use any donations or profit to fund therian websites and the like (as stated previously). Velvet Wings has a good point too.


I wouldn't say pick the best writers, because I think there are a lot of therian writers out there who aren't widely known who can write some brilliant stuff, but perhaps have it open for submissions instead? And some kind of voting system on submissions

I agree, good idea. I think we (anyone involved) could also suggest things we have read before, and liked. This could help bring the less-known authors to light.


as well as several editors to work with the writers to correct grammatical/structural/spelling/whatever errors?

I wouldn't mind being an editor, I kind of like correcting errors. I do want to play some part in 'making' the book. :)


I almost forgot to add, if you are concerned about the cost then why not crowd-fund the project? The funding could be used to provide copies of the book to those who can't afford it, or used to enlist the services of professional designers. Just a thought.

A great idea if people want a physical book rather than an ebook.

PS Thank you for all the positive feedback!

EDIT: Actually I think I'd be better just proofreading anything rather than editing. Apparently I'm not 'ruthless' enough to edit well.

Crowsong
March 23rd, 2013, 11:31 AM
So its taking off, this is very exciting, I'm quite interested in this project!

ShadowWalker
March 23rd, 2013, 01:48 PM
I'd just like to offer my assistance in any way I can, since I think it's a great idea.

Natsilani
March 23rd, 2013, 03:35 PM
What kind of stories would we put in it? Philosophical articles that therians have written, or personal anecdotes about how people grew up as or discovered they were therian, and maybe interesting events that they've been through relating to it (there is a certain toaster incident that comes to mind ^.^). Or would it be along the lines or poems or short stories?

ShadowWalker
March 23rd, 2013, 05:18 PM
What kind of stories would we put in it? Philosophical articles that therians have written, or personal anecdotes about how people grew up as or discovered they were therian, and maybe interesting events that they've been through relating to it (there is a certain toaster incident that comes to mind ^.^). Or would it be along the lines or poems or short stories?
Or how about a combination of all of the above?

UnknownTherian
March 23rd, 2013, 08:52 PM
What kind of stories would we put in it? Philosophical articles that therians have written, or personal anecdotes about how people grew up as or discovered they were therian, and maybe interesting events that they've been through relating to it (there is a certain toaster incident that comes to mind ^.^). Or would it be along the lines or poems or short stories?

Or how about a combination of all of the above?

I agree with ShadowWalker. It would be best to include a bit of everything. :) Articles, self-discovery stories, experiences, verse, all would be good.

BraveFox
March 24th, 2013, 02:43 AM
I love this idea. I'd be happy to submit one myself! As for funding, I agree with other people on crowd-funding. Kickstarters are in right now!

Mobius
March 25th, 2013, 10:13 AM
I'd have to put my word in.

I would be willing to contribute anything and everything. Anecdotes are the one thing I've written for the therian community more than anything else, and I have quite a number of them, whether therian related or not. XP

At the same time, I have experience delving both into the spiritual and psychological sides of therianthropy, and can probably write from both sides without much bias.

elinox
March 25th, 2013, 12:24 PM
The project seems interesting, and there's definitely a lack of such published books which is a shame. Might I suggest self-publishing through an online place like lulu.com (http://www.lulu.com/)? I haven't used it yet, but once the book is finished it seems fairly easy to get it into a physical book through them and then folks can pay for it as they need it. Unless the stories were collected in such a way like The Forest Voice ShadowWalker mentioned. Or available via a printable PDF or something. I personally prefer the idea of an actual book I can put on my shelf, but depending on the length, a magazine/PDF/etc. might be better and more practical.

Personally, I think articles like how to's and FAQ's aren't a good idea simply because therianthropy doesn't have any set rules per se, that, and there are plenty of websites out there dealing with this already. I think stories, poems, personal experiences are more the way to go. And having as diverse experiences as possible would be good too.

Also, as an English major, I enjoy editing/proofreading so I can help with that too.

Crowsong
March 25th, 2013, 12:58 PM
The project seems interesting, and there's definitely a lack of such published books which is a shame. Might I suggest self-publishing through an online place like lulu.com (http://www.lulu.com/)? I haven't used it yet, but once the book is finished it seems fairly easy to get it into a physical book through them and then folks can pay for it as they need it. Unless the stories were collected in such a way like The Forest Voice ShadowWalker mentioned. Or available via a printable PDF or something. I personally prefer the idea of an actual book I can put on my shelf, but depending on the length, a magazine/PDF/etc. might be better and more practical.

Personally, I think articles like how to's and FAQ's aren't a good idea simply because therianthropy doesn't have any set rules per se, that, and there are plenty of websites out there dealing with this already. I think stories, poems, personal experiences are more the way to go. And having as diverse experiences as possible would be good too.

Also, as an English major, I enjoy editing/proofreading so I can help with that too.

One must be careful with self-publishging sites though. I've heard some bad things about lulu.com and generally to steer clear of it. It has been over a year since I went to check it out, but I imagine its still essentially the same as when I did go look at..

elinox
March 25th, 2013, 03:24 PM
One must be careful with self-publishging sites though. I've heard some bad things about lulu.com and generally to steer clear of it. It has been over a year since I went to check it out, but I imagine its still essentially the same as when I did go look at..

One must also be careful of posting anything online though too. ;)

What specifically did you hear about lulu? I'm curious because I plan to eventually use them to publish my own novel someday.

Crowsong
March 25th, 2013, 06:18 PM
One must also be careful of posting anything online though too. ;)

What specifically did you hear about lulu? I'm curious because I plan to eventually use them to publish my own novel someday.

That's true, haha.

I dug up the research from back then and it actually wasn't as bad as I thought for lulu, apparently they're just overpriced in some ways. I feel kinda dumb now, but I think it caused confusion in my mind because that part of an article was amidst several articles about fraudulent publishers/ agencies/ etc.
Sorry about the semi-false alarm..

elinox
March 26th, 2013, 10:41 AM
I dug up the research from back then and it actually wasn't as bad as I thought for lulu, apparently they're just overpriced in some ways. I feel kinda dumb now, but I think it caused confusion in my mind because that part of an article was amidst several articles about fraudulent publishers/ agencies/ etc.
Sorry about the semi-false alarm..

No worries, I'm glad you mentioned it because it had the potential to rip me off. So I appreciate the info, even if it turned out lulu is relatively safe.

As far as pricing goes, I can easily see them as being a bit on the expensive side, mostly because they're widely known for self-publishing, but for only one printed copy for myself (and anyone else who'd even bother purchasing my book once finished) it didn't seem that high.

Savage
March 26th, 2013, 02:36 PM
No worries, I'm glad you mentioned it because it had the potential to rip me off. So I appreciate the info, even if it turned out lulu is relatively safe.

I'm boggled as to what we would even need Lulu for in the first place. We already have our own skills in-house to do editing, proofreading, typesetting and online sales/marketing. Additionally, my think is that this thing gets released on a sliding scale donation that starts at zero dollars or a dollar or something like that for folks who legitimately can't afford it but would benefit from the information. I don't think it's feasible to do that with a commercial service like Lulu.

elinox
March 26th, 2013, 02:58 PM
I'm boggled as to what we would even need Lulu for in the first place. We already have our own skills in-house to do editing, proofreading, typesetting and online sales/marketing. Additionally, my think is that this thing gets released on a sliding scale donation that starts at zero dollars or a dollar or something like that for folks who legitimately can't afford it but would benefit from the information. I don't think it's feasible to do that with a commercial service like Lulu.

Lulu would have allowed for a physical printed book version. The way it sounds now, this will be available online for people to print out themselves if they want. Personally, I'd rather have a hard copy book to put on my shelves rather than a magazine or PDF printed copy, but that's just me. Honestly, with the later, I could just go around and get permission from individual authors and then compile them myself instead of going through a committee. :p

Savage
March 26th, 2013, 04:16 PM
Lulu would have allowed for a physical printed book version. The way it sounds now, this will be available online for people to print out themselves if they want. Personally, I'd rather have a hard copy book to put on my shelves rather than a magazine or PDF printed copy, but that's just me. Honestly, with the later, I could just go around and get permission from individual authors and then compile them myself instead of going through a committee. :p

In that case, it may be worth researching 'print on demand' companies including Lulu for physical printed books. We can produce camera ready copy as needed to keep costs down.

Also, I would suggest that the criteria for inclusion in a printed book needs to be a hell of a lot tighter due to costs. Additional material could be included in the e-book, but a print book needs to be within a certain page count, or it will be prohibitively expensive.

cheetah
March 26th, 2013, 04:47 PM
Also, I would suggest that the criteria for inclusion in a printed book needs to be a hell of a lot tighter due to costs. Additional material could be included in the e-book, but a print book needs to be within a certain page count, or it will be prohibitively expensive.

Indeed. A given essay is usually around two or three pages, single-sided and eight by eleven. Depending on book size, that would translate into anywhere from a single leaf to two leaves. Personally, I think having each leaf by 5.5 x 8.5 is a good size; what do other people think?

Poems and illustrations would take up less room, of course. But I think the main essay will and should be on personal reflective essays. I agree that the criteria should be hard to fulfill, but how hard? If we have a two hundred page book (not that large, really, I would think), if we have an essay covering two leaves (an overestimate if anything, I think), then that's a hundred essays.

Compared to the amount of good-quality essays there are... that is a lot, I think. Expanding it to fiction, poetry, and illustrations, and we still have a fairly substantial number of essays.